Comments on: RS/MP Lesson 9: “Gifts of the Spirit” (Joseph Smith Manual)

By: Mike B

Mike B — Fri, 18 Mar 2011 12:44:54 +0000

I figured it was.

By: joespencer

joespencer — Thu, 17 Mar 2011 13:27:41 +0000

That was spam.

By: Mike B

Mike B — Thu, 17 Mar 2011 12:28:38 +0000

That was deep.

By: hampers

hampers — Thu, 17 Mar 2011 10:37:48 +0000

Great look to your blog. I think the points raised are good.

By: Bernfried

Bernfried — Wed, 26 May 2010 17:02:40 +0000

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By: Hampers

Hampers — Sun, 16 Aug 2009 05:01:28 +0000

Nice blog. Enjoyed going through it. Keep it up the good work. Cheers :)

By: RS/MP Lesson 11: “The Organization and Destiny of the True and Living Church” (Joseph Smith Manual) « Feast upon the Word Blog

Tue, 03 Jun 2008 16:02:56 +0000

[...] teaching on page 139 “the cause of truth.” Truth: if one can here draw on the previous lesson on the gifts of the Spirit, it would then seem that the truth is a question of so many signs, signs [...]

By: douglas Hunter

douglas Hunter — Tue, 13 May 2008 23:34:07 +0000

Jim, too bad I didn’t see your note until after I presented the lesson. Anyway, its not hard to see why Daniel would make that argument. D&C 20:17-28 in particular, does have a lot in common with other creedal statements including the language found in verse 23&24 and it’s general concision. I’m going to guess that someone has already done some research into this area and found a number of Mormon scriptures that can be said to be creedal in nature. I like the comparison between creedal statements because of how clearly it points out the differences between Mormon thought and that of other groups. Both the AOF and D&C 20 start with God and Jesus but then move to our role as believers. This aspect is absent from the creedal statements I’ve read from other groups. Getting back to Pelican he discussed the importance of creeds in uniting people over time in belief, as providing something constant across generations and across geography. For us, considering the young age of the Church that our creeds don’t have the same historical significance as other creeds, but since our creeds include specific language about gifts and our individual roles, I’m sure someone could make the case for a different kind of unity.

By: Jim F.

Jim F. — Tue, 13 May 2008 05:20:02 +0000

Douglas Hunter: You are no doubt right that the AOF have become our creed. However, Daniel Graham of the BYU Philosophy Department, argued at this year’s meetings of the Society for Mormon Philosophy and Theology that D&C 20:17-36 appears also to be a “Mormon creed.” Looking at those verses may help you develop the theme you propose.

By: Douglas Hunter

Douglas Hunter — Thu, 08 May 2008 03:07:34 +0000

I am teaching ch9 & ch10 together this week. I find that a comparative approach often leads to a greater appreciation of the uniqueness of Mormon theology and of JS as a religious leader.

I was listening to an interview with Yaroslav Pelican the other day about the importance of Creeds.

Anyway, in CH 9 the Articles of Faith are quoted early in the lesson. I take the AOF as our creedal statement so my introduction to the lesson will be about creeds and what makes the AOF unique among them. In particular that what is asserted as fundamental belief in the AOF includes a dynamic between the human and the divine that is still unfolding both institutionally and individually. Its my understanding that this is somewhat extraordinary for Creedal statements. Further looking at ch9 in the creedal context can be seen as reinforcing Christ’s emphasis on our situation being one in which we are situated with a commitment to both God and to the human community. The idea of Gifts serves the dual commitment in interesting ways. Our commitment and relationship with the divine allowing us to better serve the community. Finally as usually I am drawn to the mystical aspect of the concept of the gifts in that knowing what they are and how to use them is a result of our subjective experience of the divine.

By: NathanG

NathanG — Mon, 05 May 2008 02:09:43 +0000

I read the editorial today as recorded in “Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith” completely coincidentally. Two things struck me and I’m not sure they are included in the lesson manual.

“We believe in it [this gift of the Holy Ghost] in all its fullness, and power, and greatness, and glory; but whilst we do this, we believe in it rationally, consistently, and scripturally, and not according to the wild vagaries, foolish notions and traditions of men.” This also seemed to set a theme for what he was trying to accomplish.

As for the outward, as you have mentioned, Joseph seemed to focus on how there is no outward manifestation that is a proof of anything, for the only two likely outward gifts can be accounted as foolishness by other observers. However, he also seems to comment that the outward manifestations of the gifts will be discerned by the Spirit and so others can enjoy the gifts when they are part of the organism or machine if they are attuned to the Spirit to aid in that understanding. As an example he mentions that if the scribes and Pharisees had recorded the day of Pentecost they would have described people drunken with new wine, but the Apostles were able to recognize the gift of the Spirit for what it is.