Feast upon the Word Blog

A blog focused on LDS scriptures and teaching

New, limited-edition LDS Quad!

Posted by nhilton on February 22, 2007

A new, limited edition of the LDS “Quad,” known as the JNH LDS KJV accompanies me to my church meetings, is my daily study companion and invaluable gospel reference.    It’s color coded, making it especially user-friendly.  There are no blank pages, however, so adding personal notes is a challenge.  I’ve resorted to taping in additional pages with quotes, timelines, observations, lists, etc.  Finding just the right glue to repair the spine on this rare edition was a real task; it needed to be flexible when dry.  I ended up using Aleene’s “OK To Wash It” permanent fabric bond, though it did dry a bit tacky.  This book is one of my prized possessions.  I’ve actually had nightmares about loosing it.  What will I do when it returns to dust? 

  • How do you chronicle, archive and index your journey of scriptural knowledge?
  • Is there a scripture coding, marking, referencing system you’ve used and proven over time?
  • When you have an “ah ha!” moment during your scripture study, how do you record it for future reference?
  • Could you give a talk in church or teach a lesson with a set of scriptures from the ward library?  Or, like me, do you rely on your “evolved” set of standard works?
  • How do you part with an old set of well used, well marked scriptures and begin again with a fresh set?
  • How do you teach youth to respectfully mark their scriptures?

40 Responses to “New, limited-edition LDS Quad!”

  1. J. Stapley said

    Do you have a link to more on this limited edition “quad”?

  2. brianj said

    I got a new set of scriptures a few years ago. They replaced my first set, which I got in high school and were thoroughly marked up in some silly, meaningless ways (the efforts of one inexperienced with scripture study). I was so reluctant to mark anything in my new set unless it was truly important—something that I would want to notice again in the same way later. It’s been a few years and I still have not marked anything in the new set. The questions in your post came at a funny time: a few nights ago I actually had a nightmare that I had decided to start marking my scriptures. It really was a nightmare—it woke me up all worried and everything!

  3. Robert C. said

    [nhilton, I removed all the Word formatting from you post b/c it was having display problems on my computer. I know I need to fix the white-space margin on bulleted lists sometime, but if there’s some other change you would like, let me know or feel free to make the change yourself in the WordPress.com editor.]

    I still sometimes refer to a favorite set of scriptures I used before and on my mission, but they’re pretty thrashed now. Plus I don’t like feeling so reliant on that set of scriptures, b/c when I’m without them (which is more often than not) I draw too much of a blank. Also, I think some prophet (SWK perhaps) said that they would start a fresh set of scriptures every year so that they would be able to read the text “freshly” each time–or at least that’s how I remember it. Anyway, I’ve found this to be very true–when I read my well-worn set of scriptures, I’ve noticed the markings force me into reading one particular way and I think it hurts my ability to see the text in new ways.

    Soooo, the best resource I’ve found is . . . THE WIKI!! Seriously, internet access is becoming more and more common (and with cell phones), and with a customizeable pages and subpages for each user, and the ability to do electronic searches, it’s so much easier to find, index, annotate, and print out passages for talks, lessons, in-depth study etc. (We’re slowly but surely making some improvements to help newbies get started–stay tuned….)

    I know this isn’t as handy in terms of carrying to church or home/visiting teaching, but the tradeoff’s been well worth it for me. I would, however, be very interested in a set of scriptures with large margins and less flimsy paper for annotations if anyone knows where to get such a set.

  4. Kevin Barney said

    I only marked scriptures on my mission. Before that I didn’t really own a nice set; I just had the old seminary editions. On my mission I felt the need to learn the scriptures, and I marked my set up thoroughly. I served from 77-79, and just after I came home the Church came out with the 1979 edition of the KJV, and two years later the triple. So I got new scriptures, and I never marked them at all. I just never felt the need anymore. The experience of marking a set once was all that I needed.

    Now I have a large print set; I’ve never marked those, either.

  5. J. Stapley said

    I’m not a marker either Kevin, but I do understand that you get more revelation from the bigger print.

  6. nhilton said

    J.Stapley, your sense of humor transcends cyberspace. :)

    I’m an illustrator by trade so understandably a visual & kinesthetic learner. Being such, marking my scriptures helps me to remember what I study & reference it quickly. My “limited edition” is approaching 6 years and is literally falling apart.

    Robert’s comments about SWK are so true, but I think I’m dull enough to only need a new set every 4 years. Obviously I’m resisting. (Robert, thanks for the make-over.) I am wiki adverse because of the points I’ve made on other posts, namely the misinformation potential. I have, however, appreciated the links for study, but find the boxes too small for easy viewing. Another question, how do you stay informed on which threads you’re following? I loose track of comments/questions I’ve made & potential responses.

    I really can’t understand how anyone can NOT mark their scriptures…plus, it’s an excuse to color during church meetings. Really, is there no one out there who colors in their scriptures besides me???

  7. jose said

    I recently rebound my venerable scriptures and brought them back to life–the spine was shot and sections were falling out. Lots of online archival and library resources taught me how. Rather than the inside cover being the standard black paper, I used a black paper with rustic gold Thai text that reminds me of reformed Egyptian.

    The “right glue” for repairing a spine is PVA bookbinding glue. It dries clear, flexible, water soluble, and acid free.

    As with new scriptures, I was getting bored with the same-ol, so I switched to a NIV study Bible to study in SS this year. I love hearing the scriptures spoken for a different viewpoint and love all the inline commentary.

  8. Cheryl said

    #3 Robert – I am just beginning to appreciate WIKI. I especially liked this in terms of Matt 5:*: Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God:

    Barker on seeing God. In “The Secret Tradition” (http://www.marquette.edu/maqom/tradition1), Margaret Barker notes that “Seeking the face/presence of the LORD had been at the heart of the temple cult (1 Chr 16:11; 2 Chr 7:14; Ps 17:15; Ps 24:6; Ps 27:8-9; Ps 41:12; Ps 105:4 etc.)”.

    I love stuff like this.

  9. m&m said

    When I got my new scriptures after the mission (no, I haven’t gotten any more since), I started using a mechanical pencil to underline and write thoughts/impressions/quotes. I have done a little of color here and there (2005 BoM reading challenge was one of those times…had a few topics I was looking for in particular). Most of the time, though, the pencil works nicely…not too distracting, but still there.

  10. Jim F. said

    I’ve got a “new” set of scriptures that I carry with me to church meetings and that I’ve either marked nothing in or very little–I’m not sure. But I have an old set lying on my desk. I wrote in them everywhere, though I didn’t color-code them in any way. My writing consisted of observations, alternate translations, cross-references, etc. I use them when I’m working on a lesson or really studying carefully, and I continue to add annotations. (I should learn how to rebind them so that I could carry them to church again.)

    For a few months, since someone reminded me of what President Kimball said about starting over again every year, I’ve felt somewhat guilty about continuing to use my old scriptures. Then I went to the leadership training meeting and heard President Packer say that he uses the same scriptures he has used for many years because he has marked them up. Now I am once again free from guilt, at least in that.

    For me the perfect edition of the scriptures would have heavier paper so that my pencil doesn’t cut the page when I write on it, wider margins or (dare I dream?) blank pages facing pages of scripture. The obvious problem is the size that would result. I don’t have any idea what I would do with that.

    Robert, I agree that the wiki format allows for a great deal of note-taking in the scriptures, that gadgets like my Treo allow me to get to the wiki whenever I wish–all of that. In spite of that, I find it difficult to study from the Wiki because it gives me such a small section of scripture to view at one time and it is more difficult to “flip” back and forth between one scripture and another, and somewhat more difficult to look at multiple books at the same time. This may be a generational / psychological issue, but though some of us old dogs are trying to learn the new tricks, we are having a difficult time doing so as well as we might.

  11. Robert C. said

    Thanks for the comments and concerns about the wiki. A couple responses for now:

    nhilton #6: We’re working on a disclaimer about misinformation. But I think you point out an inherent tension regarding quality and accessibility that is unavoidable. We could limit who contributes to the wiki, then you’d know that there is a set list of contributors that you could credit and blame for the content. But then I think this would exclude the a lot of great material that is possible to get from others. One good thing about the wiki is that you can always click on the “history” tab and see who contributed what parts of the material if you are worried about sources. I think this is particularly useful with, for example, historical (and linguistic, to a certain extent) comments, but I think it’s less of an issue regarding interpretation of the text itself b/c I think credentials are less important for that–at the end of the day we have to determine what the text means for ourselves. (By the way, you’ll notice John has been doing a great job of putting links to the most recent Conference reports with a summary of how General Authorities have used a particular passage–I think this is a great way to use the wiki that avoids the problem of misinformation….) Also, we’re working on a follow-up post to address some of the other concerns you mentioned (thanks again for articulating these concerns).

    Jim F. #10: Yeah, books are really handy and hard to beat–I actually like to have several sets of scriptures spread out over my desk so I can study several passages and cross-references at once (though the new lds.org scripture cite makes it really easy to see several passages on one page at once). Also, I’ve found myself addicted to having two monitors so I can put the scriptures on one monitor and the wiki commentary on another. When I’m using just my laptop, I like to use Actual Window Manager so that, with a couple easy clicks, I have two windows sized and placed where I like them for optimal viewing of scripture and the window (wiki, blog, or word processor) I’m writing in….

  12. What a wonderful post. Thanks, Nanette.

    I’ve found that whatever I write in my scriptures becomes obsolete for me very quickly, within days. Usually this is because I write in order to think, and so whatever I write is part of the process of coming to real thoughts. Even when I write a whole paragraph in my scriptures, it is usually only the last sentence or phrase that is worth remembering. That has led to several sets of uselessly marked scriptures.

    In addition I’ve been generally frustrated with the lack of space for writing in the scriptures. My missionary set has almost literally no room at all for the tiniest word in many places, and so I could hardly study from them any more. I’ve found myself wishing for things like Jim has: a set of scriptures with blank sheets between pages, or half of each page empty for notes, or some such thing. I even thought at one point about cutting and pasting one verse per page for the whole of 1 and 2 Nephi and then printing it up for my own research purposes. That too, then, has frustrated me.

    And then I found something of an answer. Or rather, my wife did. She bought for me for Christmas just before I was to begin to teach the Book of Mormon in SS, the 8 1/2 x 11 sized paper back (made like the missionary edition) triple combo. It was relatively cheap (like $12 or something). It has so much more space to write it, and it is cheap enough that I don’t mind completely filling it with writing I’ll never read after a while, because I can buy another. I soon bought myself the companion Bible and I use these to study now. When I finish up with a copy, I buy another and shelve the old one. Both because they are unwieldy for taking to Church or teaching, I have a nice “high priest” edition (large print) quad that I use at Church and Church only (I don’t like teaching with any kind of notes in front of me–not even an outline for a lesson). I suppose, then, I have my large plates and my small plates: the one is meant to last forever and remain untouchable, the other is always piling up plenty of passing information, only the best of which I will ever think about again. I teach from the small plates, but I learn how to teach and to think and to read while working through the large plates. Or something like that.

    As for the wiki, it has become a major part of how I study as well. I have the same frustrations with it that Jim has, but I usually just have my large plates open on the desk as well, and my most important bookshelf next to the desk. To some degree, the wiki functions as a set of large plates for me, because I learn while writing. And I like how writing there forces me to think a bit more coherently because I know that what I write will be readable by anyone a moment after I finish it.

    Anyway, my take on it all.

  13. […] it’s interesting to see that Feast Upon the Word’s post titled “New, Limited Edition LDS Quad” made it to the list today. With all due respect to a great project, that’s not […]

  14. nhilton said

    Wow. Thanks for your observations!

    Jose, tell us how to learn HOW to rebind scriptures. Maybe a link or two, please. I’m a pack-rat & would love to rebind my old seminary scriptures that my kids have used in their seminary class, too. My husband’s mission
    scriptures, etc.

    Jim F., Thanks for the permission to keep marking & carrying my old scriptures. Pres. Packer is good company to be with.

    Robert, I’ll give the wiki another try. But one thing I’ve discovered is that I get physically sick by trying to read between screens, books, etc. I end up “motion sick” and have to take a large time-out. Sick for hours, I mean. I’ve heard that the screen flicker can make people have seisures. Maybe it’s the flicker, I don’t know. So using the monitor as I’m reading on my desk & in my lap, too, is dangerous for me. I really like your suggestion to have several scripture sets laid out to study simultaneously.

    Joe, your suggestions offer real practical help for me. I’m going to go get those large edition scriptures you mention. I, too, teach only from my scriptures so I write everything in them. Perhaps it would help ya’ll to use what I use to write with: Pigma Micron 005 black permanent pen. I use this in my artwork & have found it perfect for carefully writing in my scriptures.

    Some of the things I like to write in the previously blank pages of my scriptures are: homilies I have found; a list of my favorite scriptures by reference & topic; Seminary scripture mastery list; quotes ABOUT scripture study; exegesis directions, i.e. “understanding scriptural symbols;” diagrams of Solomon’s temple; statistics like how many times the word “Atonement” is found in particular books; lists about a topic, i.e. “taking upon ourselves Christ’s name”; world-wide religion stats; dates as to when a particular scripture was relevant, i.e. scriptures used during 9/11 memorials by GA & others world-wide; etc. So, you can see my scriptures are like a kind of journal.

    All your comments have been really helpful! Thank you!

  15. robf said

    If at the World Leadership Training Broadcast you caught how long Elder Packer has been carrying around his marked scriptures, you’ll realize that he must be carrying around the pre-1979 versions without all the extras.

  16. jose said

    nhitlon, per your request:
    For good tutorials with picts, see:

    http://www.csparks.com/Bookbinding/index.xhtml

    http://www.uwm.edu/~bryskier/bookbinding.htm

    And for a list of other tutorials, see:

    http://www.philobiblon.com/tutorials.shtml

    For book binding supplies including cool paper and leathers, see:

    http://talasonline.com/

    http://www.hollanders.com/index.shtml

    Once you know how a book is made, just take the book apart, replace the worn or broken parts, and put it back together. I used PVA glue for the paper parts and I found Fabri-tac worked well to glue my original leather cover back on new endpapers. But you could buy new leather or put a simple hardback cover on those old seminary scriptures.

  17. I just realized I said something that wasn’t clear. The quad that I take to Church I leave completely unmarked. I like to teach from a completely clean set so that my own notes don’t distract me from the Spirit in the classroom. Anyway….

  18. nhilton said

    Joe, do you use the lesson manual when you’re teaching or forego that, too? You must have an amazing memory! I think I’d be fumbling around trying to find my cross references, or at least a direction to head off into, too much if I were teaching a class w/o at least my marked scriptures. I used to have notes to help me stay “on track.” As a student I’d be fine, but when I’m suppose to direct or moderate the discussion I think I’d be too free-wheeling. How do you do it?!

    jose, those were great links. Thanks! Now I know what to suggest for our next “Enrichment Mtg” vs. the usual boring stuff!

  19. John said

    Gee, thanks! (RobertC #11) Since I started my “little” wiki project, I have fallen behind in my participation on the blog. I was surprised to see my name mentioned.

    RE scripture study, I use a marking system intended to draw my eye to specific parts of the verse. I do not highlight the whole passage, rather I underline for context and highlight (full line height) key words and phrases.

    Like Robert, I feel my markings sometimes get in the way of seeing the scriptures in new ways, but I occasionally enjoy reading just the “juicy” parts and pondering on them both as the author wrote them (in context) and as aphorisms unto themselves.

    In the past three years I have used three colors, and they don’t have any special meaning other than the time period in which I used them. I can tell approximately WHEN a scripture was marked by its color, so I can also extrapolate something about my interpretation of the scripture based on the events of my life at the time I marked it.

    I also write links to other scriptures in the margins. I originally started to do this to fill in what I thought were gaps in the cross-references provided by the footnotes. If I recall a related verse while I’m reading, I’ll take the time to look it up and write it in. Doing so has provided deeper insight into the history and meaning of the scriptures, personal revelation, and improved overall scripture mastery.

    That’s it. No other margin notes, no color-coding, no “system.”

  20. In all of what I explained, I never said what I actually write in the scriptures. I underline with black pen whatever seems significant at the time (this, of course, in my cheap but very large set of scriptures, never in my nice ones), and then I write paragraphs of information as I think through verses, passages, chapters, books, volumes, etc., in the margins, at the top and bottom of the page, and on full empty pages.

    Nanette, as for teaching without notes: when and if I can get away with it, I don’t even use the manual to prepare, let alone to teach! I thought I was notorious enough around here to have that one be obvious. No, I stand before the class with nothing more than an unmarked set of scriptures. If I “forget” something while standing there, I call it a “stupor of thought,” and I trust it comes from God. You would probably have to see my teaching style more directly, though, to see how I do this. I don’t prepare anything, so notes would do me little good. I’m going to work up a post sometime today on this subject, so maybe that will clarify things. Anyway….

  21. nhilton said

    Joe, I’m sure you didn’t really mean “I don’t prepare anything…” because I’m sure you do, otherwise you wouldn’t have anything to teach. Perhaps you should clarify that statement.

  22. John said

    Neither take ye thought beforehand what ye shall say; but treasure up in your minds continually the words of life, and it shall be given you in the very hour that portion that shall be meted unto every man. — (D&C 84:85)

    Joe is always preparing. :D

  23. nhilton said

    Exactly.

  24. nhilton said

    So I just bought a NIV Bible. Interesting. I got it at Wal-Mart for less than $20. It has already been a blessing, see Jim’s GD#9 Lesson post re: the line that should be left out of the Lord’s Prayer but is included in our KJV. Does anyone else like a Bible translation for studying other than the KJV or am I just pushing the envelope here?

    Oh, & Joe, I went & bought the super huge editions of the LDS KJV soft-cover scriptures for at-home writing in. They weren’t cheap & I had to hunt for them. I ended up buying one at a local Deseret Book & ordering the Bible at Deseret Book on-line. Couldn’t find it at the distribution center website. I’m excited to start MARKING THEM UP! :)

  25. Robert C. said

    nhilton, you might find this FPR post on different translations interesting (the comments discuss several out there). My sense is that the NIV is (or at least has been) the most popular translation among Christians and that the NRSV is the most popular among academics (and is perhaps growing in popularity among lay-Christians).

    Of special note: Etz Hayim edition of the new JPS for OT (see the FPR post, comment #15), Barney et al for NT (see left sidebar links, these are just KJV footnotes), and the NET Reader’s edition which I want to buy b/c I think it has the most extensive set of footnotes and looks like a very convenient-to-carry edition (and relatively affordable at $30).

  26. I echo Robert’s endorsement of the NRSV. I highly recommend the HarperCollins Study Bible edition of that (I’ve found it in like-new condition on Amazon for like fifteen bucks). It has good footnotes in addition to the textual notes, and it has introductions for every book. It is certainly not a commentary in itself, but I have found it helpful on occasion.

    I also use the NIV. I like the Jerusalem Bible (I have looked at the New Jerusalem Bible), because it aims at perfect literalness in its translation. I also like having a reprint of the 1611 edition of the KJV on hand, for a number of reasons.

    Beyond English, I’ve found that Luther’s Bible is very helpful, and I’m fascinated by the feel of Die Schrift, a German translation of the OT by Franz Rosenzweig. If you can do Latin, the Vulgate is a must, and if you can do Greek, you definitely want a copy of the Septuagint. I find that the translation of the NT I use the most (besides the “original” Greek) is a Hebrew facing KJV English. That one helps me to think the text in terms of OT thinking, which is very helpful for me.

    While on the subject, let me put in my words on the rest of the scriptures too. I highly suggest the Reader’s Edition of the Book of Mormon, edited by Grant Hardy. The 1830 edition is a must (there are a couple different formats for obtaining this). And of course all the running volumes of textual analysis by Skousen are incredibly helpful. An absolute must have for D&C study is Wilford Wood’s Joseph Smith Begins His Work, vol. 2. For the JST, the original manuscripts are really the only resource (Joseph Smith’s New Translation of the Bible edited by Faulring, Jackson, and Matthews). And I’m eagerly anticipating the publication of the Abraham manuscripts sometime next year (was it Rhodes who was working on this?). The 1851 Pearl of Great Price is a bit harder to come by, but it can be had on the New Mormon Studies CD Rom (which runs about $200, unfortunately).

    A couple of other resources I like are Donald parry’s The Book of Mormon Text Reformatted According to Parallelistic Patterns, the RLDS Hebrew translation of the Book of Mormon (modern Hebrew, unfortunately, but a curious resource nonetheless), and I certainly recommend being familiar with http://www.saintswithouthalos.com.

    What else?

  27. nhilton said

    What else? Joe? O.k. here’s where I’m going with my study: I want to learn Greek today & Latin tomorrow. I’ve “researched” educational books for this purpose on Amazon but really don’t know where to turn. I want Biblical Hebrew, too. I don’t know if this is just wishful thinking w/o actually enrolling in a formal language course or not. I considered Rosetta Stone but really am aiming at Biblical study instead of converational or writing. I don’t know what to do now that this desire has begun to sprout…oh, & did I mention I have 5 kids, professional illustrator, finishing a degree, GD teacher (that doesn’t count, right?!)etc…thus ZERO time to do all this?! I want the lazy woman’s version of Greek, Latin & Hebrew. Any suggestions? (Besides “get real!)

    BTW, Robert & Joe, those were such helpful pointers for me in other Bible & study resources. Thanks for giving me this info!

  28. nhilton said

    Joe, I am considering getting a Vulgate & Septuagint. I don’t know what kind to get. Should I get a parallel columne one or just shoot for the real McCoy & learn the languages in which to read them? (This is daunting.) Actually, unless I learn the language I don’t really see the point in having them at all & the parallel columne one could either handicap me into always reading the translation, in which case I might as well just be reading an English translation Bible anyhow, or maybe it would help me learn the new language? Any suggestion?

  29. Hmmm.

    It really depends on what you want to do with it. A parallel edition can help you learn the language, that is for certain, and it will help you locate passages when you are still new to the language. My Vulgate is just Latin, but my Septuagint has English in the margins. I find I don’t even look at the English, though. So, I don’t personally think there is too much problem having the parallel texts.

    As for books by which to study the language. Latin: Wheelock’s; nothing but Wheelock’s. It has been the best for a long time. For Greek, again it depends on what you are trying to do. I preferred to learn classical Greek so that I could approach the Koine (the NT Greek) from its roots. That means that I used Hansen and Quinn’s Greek: An Intensive Course. There are many good books on learning NT Greek, though. I’m not overly familiar with any of them. Maybe Jim would have more say on that?

    If you decide to bury yourself in Greek, there are a couple of other tools you will probably want to have. A Greek concordance of the NT is almost necessary. You can find these used for about $15. They list every occurrence of each Greek word in the NT together, so that you can do comparative studies, etc. You will also want a good lexicon. The traditional one is Thayer’s, but, to be quite honest, it is very limited. A much better one, though it is quite a bit more difficult to use, is Liddell and Scott’s Intermediate Greek Lexicon. It focuses, as I do, on Classical Greek, so it may or may not be up your alley. A pricy one, of course, is the Theological Dictionary of the New Testament, by Gerhard Kittel, et al. It is getting to be a bit dated (not a whole lot), but it remains a fantastic resource.

    Also, if you are familiarizing yourself with Latin or Greek, get familiar with http://www.perseus.tufts.edu. It is a website dedicated to the study of the Classics. It has several Greek and Latin lexica on the site that are searchable (the best lexica, by the way), and it has most of the important Classics on the site, readable in the original. Many of them are hotkeyed to the lexica as well (you click on the word, and it opens the lexicon).

    Anyway, I hope that helps. If you begin to study Hebrew at any point, I highly recommend Gesenius’ Hebrew Grammar, recently republished by Dover Publications (which cut its price from $50 used to $25 new!). It is not exactly an easy tool, but you can work your way through Hebrew with it. A good introduction to the basics that would get you ready for Gesenius is Gary Practico’s The Basics of Biblical Hebrew. Very well written, and very accessible.

    As far as having so much on your plate, here is my suggestion: be quite liberal and quite creative in your approaching the languages. Even if you don’t feel like you have a grasp on things, start looking up NT verses in Greek or OT verses in Hebrew, etc. Look at the dictionaries and lexica and start thinking. Use these resources as a help to your normal study first, while you take your time learning the language. There are aspects of Hebrew study that simply will take you years to be ready for, but 90% of what you want to get out of Hebrew study you can get within six months, if you just take a little time for it.

    Anyway, some thoughts. I urge you on!

  30. nhilton said

    Joe, why learn Latin if the original text was Hebrew. Shouldn’t I just learn only Hebrew?

  31. Robert C. said

    After looking up a bunch of Greek and Hebrew words in Lexicons (again, I think Blue Letter Bible is the best online resource for this) and learning some very basic grammar (Hebrew grammar is pretty simple, Greek is much more complex), I decided to quit saying that don’t know Greek or Hebrew—that has helped me with my mental block that tends to inhibit the learning of a language.

    Also, since my knowledge of grammar is so rudimentary, and I’m very forgetful, I find morphological dictionaries very helpful b/c they explain what tense, conjugation, etc. each word is used in. I broke down and got this package (I found it for about $300 through an Aussie company whose name I can’t remember right now), so I can only recommend morphologies found in that package….

  32. Reasons to study the Latin (I would highly recommend Hebrew over Latin, by the way): the Vulgate predates the Masoretic text by six centuries (though not the DSS texts); reading the Vulgate is absolutely necessary for Catholic study; the Vulgate stands behind much of the KJV translation; knowing the Latin texts is very helpful for studies of liturgy (and music, for that matter) and even of poetry, etc.; and the Vulgate is an amazing place to study the nature of translation and its effect on thinking, theology, and historicity (if this last one seems like nonsense, I highly recommend After Babel by George Steiner).

    Anyway….

    I tried to cajole Robert into getting me that languages package for Christmas, but it didn’t work. :) I mention it to my wife once or twice a week, in anticipation of my August birthday.

  33. Robert, where did you buy this for the $300 price? How much time did it take you to get proficient in it? Would BYU host a “Camp Logos?” I’d like training with the package if I’m going to invest this kind of $ & time into it.

    I was amazed at the quantity of material included in the package. I probably could have already paid for it had I not bought many of the books it includes. However, I like a hard copy to hold in my hand to augment my computer study…I’ve already mentioned I’m monitor adverse.

    So, with your experience, which actual texts would I need to go along with this? I’m beginning a Greek study group (Ha!) and don’t really know where to begin. I wish BYU offered a Greek Independent Study class, like they do the Hebrew.

  34. nhilton said

    Uh…”ponderpaths” = nhilton. :) Just so you know we’re still having the same conversation. Thanks!

  35. Robert C. said

    nhilton, the Aussie firm I mentioned above is Koorong.com (you can also find the package on ebay). Notice all prices there are in Aussie dollars. I really like the TDNT that came with the package, but I’m a little disappointed in the other stuff—a lot of titles, but not the kind of things I use all that frequently (I think the one-volume abridged TDNT which I think you can find for under $50, a couple grammar books a couple lexicons, and perhaps a morphological dictionary would probably be more than enough, and could probably all be found for about 1/2 what I spent–and it would be hard cover if you’re screen averse). I think the software package is pretty self-explanatory, it didn’t take me very long to get up to speed using it (though surely there are features I should still learn).

  36. nhilton said

    Thanks. I just ordered the Mounce set of Biblical Greek learning tools. Ask me in a year how it all worked out. :) Your help has been very…well…helpful!!

  37. keyword

    I don’t agree with you in 100%, but you covered some good points regarding this topic

  38. Doctor said

    Very useful! Thx

  39. Neva Wison said

    Thanks very much for sharing this interesting post. I am just starting up my own blog and this has given me inspiration to what I can achieve.

  40. It’s kind of funny how my set of lds scriptures has evolved. On my mission, I did a lot of color coding of topics (faith, baptism, the Holy Ghost, etc), but my newer set I just write all over in. If I want to find a passage later, I have to use my good old index. I can generally remember where on the page I have written something on, so that helps as well.

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